Mike says Dogen's writings need to be interpreted from real experience here and now, not from ideas of a better place

Carried away by ideas

Maybe I’ll start with how to study Dogen’s writings, or Buddhist writings, without being overwhelmed by words and ideas.^[1]

In the modern world, we have a tendency to prefer ideas to what is in front of us. In English, we say we become carried away. And we’re often carried away and don’t notice where we are.^[1]

And Buddhist ideas can also carry us away. There have been many Buddhist writings which suggest there is a better place or a better life than this one. Christianity also has the same belief. And we can make efforts in this life to reach this better state. In Christianity, they explain it by saying that we will become one with God; Brahmanism suggested that we could become one with Brahman. To make ourselves into a perfect state is a very common idea in world religions, and Buddhism was no exception. The perfect place they called Nirvana, and the state of reaching it satori, or enlightenment. In Dogen’s writings too, if we look for that meaning, we can sometimes find it. And we can dream of a better place than our miserable lives, with problems all the time.^[2][3]

Nothing to attain somewhere else

However, Dogen, in his writings, insisted that this world is the only real world. This state is the only real state, this place the only real place, this time the only real time. So there’s nothing to attain, in the sense of getting somewhere else. With Dogen, we have this strange explanation that we are making an effort to get where we already are.^[3]

Studying experience

Dogen’s writings were written in Japanese and Chinese eight hundred years ago, so we have to find a meaning for ourselves. We can use our brain to infer what it means, or ask somebody who we think knows. But there’s one very important thing in finding the meaning, and it’s quite difficult, because almost all our education is learning information which is given to us by outside people: received knowledge. Nobody at school says to you, please think about this and find the meaning yourself.^[3][4]

But studying Dogen’s writings is a little different. Because Dogen is writing about this place, this state, this time, this experience, we need to interpret it based on this place, this time, this person, this state. Many, many people interpret Buddhist literature based on something else which they read, or something which they heard. Dogen sometimes says that all the gods in heaven will help us, so some people think, I must believe in gods in heaven. Or he writes about a very peaceful supreme state, and we think, there is a peaceful supreme state which I have to find.^[4]

But Dogen writes many times in the Shobogenzo that we should study things in experience. In Japanese, it’s one phrase: study experience. It sounds a little strange, because usually study means using our brain, and experience means something which happens in our life. But what Dogen is saying is that to understand his writings and Buddhism, we need to interpret what we are reading based on our own real experience in this world, in this state, at this time, in this place.^[5]

Past the screen

But we can’t help thinking: he’s talking about Buddha, and I’m not a Buddha; he’s talking about the supreme state, and I haven’t had it. So we try to understand his writings based on an idea, something that we didn’t experience, and we make them into spiritual writings. But they’re not spiritual writings. Sometimes they’re poetic, but they’re always realistic.^[5]

If we interpret his writings based on our own real experience here and now, we have to look at ourselves: what can he mean about something I experienced? He says zazen is the gate to peaceful happiness. Do I feel peaceful or happy? What does peaceful and happy mean? This is study in experience. But if we study in a spiritual way, we think, if I practice more, I will become peaceful and happy. Then we are always searching for something. But he says many times, what we are searching for is in front of us.^[5]

Unfortunately, what is in front of most of us is a television screen, or a phone screen, or a social screen. We interpret the world based on society, based on the teachings we received about living in our society, living in our culture. We have to find a way past the screen, past the books, into this world here and now. It’s a very, very difficult effort, but a very important effort. Dogen calls it the one great task.^[5][6]

Studying with somebody who has studied

Even translated into English, the Shobogenzo is very, very difficult. How to study it is a big problem, and I don’t know what the solution is. My solution, accidentally, was to study in Japan with a Japanese teacher who studied for many years, and very slowly to discover the real meaning. But it’s much quicker if you study with somebody who studied already, and who interpreted the meaning not based on some idea, not based on some beautiful state to attain, but based on their own real experience.^[6]

That’s not so easy. But fortunately, what I’m saying to you now is based on what Dogen wrote. To study his original writings is a big task. If you don’t want to do that, you can study with somebody who did it already, standing on their shoulders. But we shouldn’t forget that Dogen is not writing about somewhere else. He’s writing about how to live. If we hear one or two important principles, for instance the ones I talked about last night in Banská Štiavnica, we can use them to examine our life. That may be the best we can do.^[6][7]

Acting wholly

For instance, there is always a result of every action. Everything we do has a result, without any exception. So our behaviour is very important. I’m not saying we need to be good; I’m saying something different. The only place where we can act is now, and we need to be here and now to act fully. You can see many people walking along the street looking at their phones, bumping into other people.^[7]

From the Buddhist point of view, all these things are incomplete action. Buddhism recommends that we act completely, not half in our brain and half in reality. That’s quite difficult. The modern world teaches us to multitask, and maybe sometimes we have to do it. But the quality of whole experience is different to the quality of partial experience: in art, in music, in sport, in life. So this is what you can find by reading Dogen. But you can find it without reading Dogen, because I just told you.^[7]

Being in the present moment

Roman: Because you say we should try to be in the present moment, how critical should we be of ourselves, for example about past mistakes? Should we just ignore our mistakes, or should we somehow reflect on them? Because if we reflect, we are not in the present moment.

I didn’t mean to say that we should be in the present moment. What I meant to say was that Buddhism teaches that to be in the present moment is being in reality, is being whole, is being awake, is being a Buddha, which means awake. And when we are in the present moment, the quality of our action is different. We can experience this. And as a whole civilization, we can slowly discover this.^[8]

Boris: My experience as a doctor is that if we don’t act fully and wholly, diseases start. Many people have problems digesting food, and I think that the intestine is connected with thinking. So meditation or zazen is, I think, a medical product.

So slowly, the world is discovering these kinds of simple facts. If we are watching a film while we’re eating supper, our brain is doing one thing, our mouth is doing another thing, and our intestine is confused. However, it’s very difficult in the modern world to live this kind of dream, always in the present moment. Only eating when we’re eating. So we have to notice the real situation, and we have to avoid or solve the problem.^[9]

The meaning of perfect

Is Buddhism telling us to be perfect? I can understand complete action, being in the present moment, the benefit. But I can’t do it. So there must be some kind of progress: we get better and better. Strangely, this is a kind of contradiction, two things which are opposite, sitting beside each other.^[10]

If we pursue the ideal of perfect Buddhism, we will never find it, because always, in our mind, we put together the perfect picture. But life is not perfect in the same way that our ideas are perfect. So when Dogen writes about perfect, does he mean the perfect picture I have in my mind? Always acting perfectly, always in the present? Or does he mean this chaotic mess in front of me? And he always means this chaotic mess in front of me. That is the meaning of perfect.^[11]

So in the end we have to throw away words, our beautiful idea of Buddhism. We are always gradually building up a perfect picture, and we have to throw it away and face reality, again and again. And Dogen writes that all our mistakes lead us to the truth. Although his writings sound very beautiful sometimes, he’s always pointing us back to this chaotic mess, full of problems, difficulties. It should be different. That’s it. That’s where we are. That’s life. We have to get on with it.^[12]

And in a strange way, it’s perfect. Not perfect in that sense. Perfect because the coffee cup is standing on the floor. Everything is perfect. Everything works perfectly. Nothing is out of balance. We sit on a chair, and the chair keeps us up. The sun comes out and we feel the warmth. So when we notice that the world is like a bright pearl, perfect as it is, we feel some kind of peaceful feeling. Not this peaceful feeling we imagine: no argument, no problem. Where is it? Here. When is it? Now.^[12]

Roman: The time went over.

Perfect.^[12]